allroad Update

[onceover]

Re: allroad Update

Ya, no meth.

Took the pump out when it decided to stay on and pump 4L of fluid into the engine all at once.

edit: Crap, this is Graeme posting on Pat's account..

[R-Audi]

Re: allroad Update

300-350km per 75L tank in the cold.

We will see what kind of mileage I get now, only have 50km on it since I picked it up.

I didnt know the AllRoad gas tank was that much bigger... I get about the same mileage with my 55 (or is it 60) litre tank...

[The_Jerbel]

Re: allroad Update

63l, iirc

[R_Ethug]

Re: allroad Update

yea mark

s4 has 60l tank.. AR has like 80l tank

well this is my math when gas was about 1/L

55 fillup for S4.. 75 fillup for AR ahaha

[RONDAL]

Re: allroad Update

im getting like 500-550/tank right now.
of course the other night i burned a 1/4 tank just doing tunnel runs downtown listening ot my exhaust. pig rich tune and 72lb injectors getting an AFR to 6.6 means pure fuel.

[Mantis]

Re: allroad Update

Careful, when you start getting that rich, you can cause major damage with cylinder wash.

I have no idea how you are getting such good mileage when you are clearly dumping fuel, are you sure your WB is working correctly

[The Brice]

Re: allroad Update

No doubt, seems odd you're getting such good mileage if your tune is that rich.

[RONDAL]

Re: allroad Update

i dont do it much, its like 2 seconds per every 100km's of driving. i watch my AFR now to ensure im not going to the point where it riches out more than like 10.
2nd gear is the only gear i can WOT in without issue, everything else i gotta granny shift, and thats why im getting such good mileage.

[N'Syncro]

Re: allroad Update

Nice numbers!

What exactly did the dyno guys do, and how? You run a VAST program, no?

And the allroad's tank is 70L (18.5 us gallons)

[Triple G]

Re: allroad Update

Thanks, my allroad uses eurodyne. The got new base file and worked it from there.

When I run the allroad empty it's not hard getting over 70L of fuel into it.

[aliencurv]

Re: allroad Update

i dont do it much, its like 2 seconds per every 100km's of driving. i watch my AFR now to ensure im not going to the point where it riches out more than like 10.
2nd gear is the only gear i can WOT in without issue, everything else i gotta granny shift, and thats why im getting such good mileage.

If you're accelerating with a light throttle, then your afr's should be pretty much standard and get great milleage. The problem I noticed with the eurodyne when playin with g's car was the fuel modifiers were just that. It is much more effecient to tune a MAP solution than a MAF (with turbo). And funny, audi really bastardized the MAF/Load interface (or at least eurodyne did). My car is tuned with Tuner Pro, which is a EEPROM editor and the interface is tables (like excel) for each 2d/1d array. The Eurodyne combines some of those arrays to create multiplier grids that do calcutions for you. It makes it easy to change fueling, but difficult to give attention to specific areas.

No wideband that i know of can accurately display a afr less than 10. So if you see 10, lol do'nt even worry because yup its rich. Richness is a "trick" that has been used for ever to cool the cylinder temps with fuel, and semi flood the mixture to prevent pre-ignition/detonation. But it never means more power. In fact, half a point of afr leaning out will add a substantial ammount of horsepower. Torque usually benefits from a rich mixture however. If you're in the 10's at WOT then there is a lot of power left by leanin the mixture. If your tuner is afraid to lean it out due to detonation then he will have to compensate with ignition timing. With a leaner (more effecient) mixture, you may have less timing but maintain the same power (and that's better)

as for cylinder washout. it "sort of" is possible in theory, but i've never been exposed to it. you would need to idle @ 2k rpm with injectors 100% duty cycle to have enough fuel to consider having that affect. So you'd actually stall before it could happen. Injectors (even at 100% of huge butt 10000000cc's etc) don't spray that much . hence why you can get 500+km/tank on the highway.

Once I was dating this girl who had a short fuse. Really sucked and we were supposed to leave for vacation to seattle, vancouver island on the monday. Well I had my engine out (rebuilding) on the saturday. I built it, put it in and started tuning it by sunday. I Was so exhausted that i figured the tune looked "okay" for the road trip. Lots had changed compression ratio, stroke, boost, etc... So we started driving on the monday and i realized at highway speeds on cruise my tune was 12-12.5 .. too rich. And when i'd TOUCHED the gas it would drop below 10. we were donig 175-200 km/tank .. Absolutely ridiculous! Well I figured its only money so who cares, i'd rather spend money then get biznitched by a girl who was letting me put stuff in her. So we drove the 4000km road trip running PIG rich. It was so bad that ppl driving behind us would have tears in their eyes! lol (thank you alberta for not requiring catalytic convertors!) .. So yah i was worried about this whole "cylinder flush" thing. Until i spoke to a few ppl when i returned that explained it to me. Pretty much how i'm explaining it to you, it won't happen. There just isn't enough fuel to make it happen... The car will stall due to a oxygen starvation before that happens.

Also a good example is water/meth.. We spray pooploads of it (g sprayed a lot more than any of us lol) and no problems. If anything, i'd worry more about seafoam (which is like adding varsol to your oil) than damaging your engine from running rich.

But I don't condone too much richness in tuning. Its a hack that robs you of potential energy. Water/Meth is the solution... With a water meth, u should be able to get around 12-12.5:1 afr at wot under considerably high loads. without meth i'd aim for 11-11.5:1 ... I know Cam uses knock sensor headphones and his WM solutions are programmable from the standalone. I've seen his mixtures get REAL lean on a very effecient build with WM, really impressive stuff. But his mind works in mysterious ways that I can't understand most of the time... Exspecially when it comes to ignition timing :P

[The_Jerbel]

Re: allroad Update

Very nice writeup, D.J.

I would completely agree with 99% of what you wrote

*thumbs up*

[RONDAL]

Re: allroad Update

If you're accelerating with a light throttle, then your afr's should be pretty much standard and get great milleage. The problem I noticed with the eurodyne when playin with g's car was the fuel modifiers were just that. It is much more effecient to tune a MAP solution than a MAF (with turbo). And funny, audi really bastardized the MAF/Load interface (or at least eurodyne did). My car is tuned with Tuner Pro, which is a EEPROM editor and the interface is tables (like excel) for each 2d/1d array. The Eurodyne combines some of those arrays to create multiplier grids that do calcutions for you. It makes it easy to change fueling, but difficult to give attention to specific areas.

No wideband that i know of can accurately display a afr less than 10. So if you see 10, lol do'nt even worry because yup its rich. Richness is a "trick" that has been used for ever to cool the cylinder temps with fuel, and semi flood the mixture to prevent pre-ignition/detonation. But it never means more power. In fact, half a point of afr leaning out will add a substantial ammount of horsepower. Torque usually benefits from a rich mixture however. If you're in the 10's at WOT then there is a lot of power left by leanin the mixture. If your tuner is afraid to lean it out due to detonation then he will have to compensate with ignition timing. With a leaner (more effecient) mixture, you may have less timing but maintain the same power (and that's better)

as for cylinder washout. it "sort of" is possible in theory, but i've never been exposed to it. you would need to idle @ 2k rpm with injectors 100% duty cycle to have enough fuel to consider having that affect. So you'd actually stall before it could happen. Injectors (even at 100% of huge butt 10000000cc's etc) don't spray that much . hence why you can get 500+km/tank on the highway.

Once I was dating this girl who had a short fuse. Really sucked and we were supposed to leave for vacation to seattle, vancouver island on the monday. Well I had my engine out (rebuilding) on the saturday. I built it, put it in and started tuning it by sunday. I Was so exhausted that i figured the tune looked "okay" for the road trip. Lots had changed compression ratio, stroke, boost, etc... So we started driving on the monday and i realized at highway speeds on cruise my tune was 12-12.5 .. too rich. And when i'd TOUCHED the gas it would drop below 10. we were donig 175-200 km/tank .. Absolutely ridiculous! Well I figured its only money so who cares, i'd rather spend money then get biznitched by a girl who was letting me put stuff in her. So we drove the 4000km road trip running PIG rich. It was so bad that ppl driving behind us would have tears in their eyes! lol (thank you alberta for not requiring catalytic convertors!) .. So yah i was worried about this whole "cylinder flush" thing. Until i spoke to a few ppl when i returned that explained it to me. Pretty much how i'm explaining it to you, it won't happen. There just isn't enough fuel to make it happen... The car will stall due to a oxygen starvation before that happens.

Also a good example is water/meth.. We spray pooploads of it (g sprayed a lot more than any of us lol) and no problems. If anything, i'd worry more about seafoam (which is like adding varsol to your oil) than damaging your engine from running rich.

But I don't condone too much richness in tuning. Its a hack that robs you of potential energy. Water/Meth is the solution... With a water meth, u should be able to get around 12-12.5:1 afr at wot under considerably high loads. without meth i'd aim for 11-11.5:1 ... I know Cam uses knock sensor headphones and his WM solutions are programmable from the standalone. I've seen his mixtures get REAL lean on a very effecient build with WM, really impressive stuff. But his mind works in mysterious ways that I can't understand most of the time... Exspecially when it comes to ignition timing :P

is there any way to make it so ALL of DJ's posts are this informative?

*thumbs up*

[aliencurv]

Re: allroad Update

is there any way to make it so ALL of DJ's posts are this informative?

*thumbs up*

Even the seafoam started as informative. it depends on ppls polical views in their reply if they wish to challenge me with personal attacks rather than information. Then I throw my hands in the air and use the incident as an excuse to be as ridic as possible for enjoyment ...

I'm glad that your car is running great. And Graemes too, of course. It makes me wish I had time to fix my cars. Well, specifically just the audi. I still don't have first gear and now i have a vacum leak from somewhere *Shrug*. HA, poor car is falling apart :( .. Time seems to be an expensive luxury lately.

I might have missed a post, but what tuning solution are you runnign andrew? is it eurodyne also? I was debating on doing a bunch of work to the audi this summer, but i've become content with what i have. I'm changing in my old age

[RONDAL]

Re: allroad Update

eurodyne too